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Kogelvis forum • Toon onderwerp - Biocellatussssssssssjjj

Biocellatussssssssssjjj

Alles omtrent brakwater kogelvissen

Re: biocellatussssssssssjjj

Berichtdoor Ruben » 21 aug 2015 22:13

Komt uit een boekje, boekjes wijsheid!
https://books.google.nl/books?id=sZQbV7 ... us&f=false
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Re: biocellatussssssssssjjj

Berichtdoor Nanda » 21 aug 2015 22:32

Dank Ruben!

Is dat dat boek uit 1996?
True pufferlove does exist!
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Re: biocellatussssssssssjjj

Berichtdoor Ruben » 21 aug 2015 22:53

Ja, toen had je nog een pak zout voor een gulden. :p
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Re: Biocellatussssssssssjjj

Berichtdoor Lode » 22 aug 2015 07:09

Ten eerste 0,5% zout is nauwelijks meetbaar en beïnvloed de bacteriën in het filter ook nauwelijks, eigenlijk gewoon verwaarloosbaar. Volgens mij is 0,5% zout ook niet 0.005, dit is een andere schaal toch?

Je hebt geluk dat je pH relatief hoog is. Zoals Grunsven zegt ze geven de voorkeur aan een bepaalde osmotische waarde. In het aquarium het meest eenvoudig te simuleren met wat zout.

Gedurende het onderzoek voor de database hebben we veel tijd in deze kwestie gestoken. De definitieve voor een brakwater vis is nogal wisselend wat het verwarrend maakt.

Eigenlijk zijn er hoofdzakelijk zoet en zoutwater kogelvissen kwamen wij tot onze verbazing achter. Sommige zoutwater varianten migreren wel. Bij vrijwel elke brakwater kogelvis is wel een vraagteken te plaatsen.

Wat mij betreft is het meest typerend aan een "brakwater" kogelvis dat ze snelle schommelingen in zout makkelijk en op lange termijn kunnen verwerken (zeker omhoog). Overwennen van zout naar licht brak is daarvoor dan ook niet nodig, wel om andere redenen.

Om diverse redenen hebben we uiteindelijk besloten de f8 onder de brakwater kogelvissen te categoriseren. Een voorname was dat ze het simpelweg beter in brakwater doen en we ons primair richten op aquarianen. Ik heb ze ooit ook op zoet gehad toen er nog geen internet sites voor kogelvissen waren. Toen ik er achter kwam dat ze wel van wat zout hielden en dit toevoegde herkende ik de vissen niet meer terug, geen glaswand zwemmen, kleur, groei, eetgedrag alles werd beter. Ik wou dat ik het eerder had geweten. Ik durf zelfs te stellen dat ik het dieren mishandeling vind ze lange termijn op zoet te houden, tenzij je waterwaardes gaat beïnvloeden met kalk etc. Maja flikker er dan voor 20 cent jodiumvrij zout in. Ja ik heb ze 20+ jaar geleden dit ook aangedaan, om maar aan te geven niet de moraal lul uit te willen hangen.

Iedereen is vrij om te experimenteren, maar houdt er wel rekening mee dat het hier om dieren gaat. Je bak is te klein er zitten nog andere vissen in, zout maar even aanzien, etc. Waarom niet gewoon even gewacht en het ineens goed doen?

Zelfde geldt voor het "redden" van kogelvissen. Dat de betreffende vis er slecht bij zat geeft wat mij betreft niet de mogelijkheid om maar wat te gaan experimenteren met medicijnen, slecht ingedraaide bakken, etc. Mogelijk kan onder het momvan eigenwijsheid en "kennis" vanalles, maar vraag me af hoe de vis hier over denkt.

Beetje of topic, maar wou het even kwijt. Misschien apart topic voor aanmaken, want dit topic is wel erg vette discussie :)
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Re: Biocellatussssssssssjjj

Berichtdoor Juliette » 22 aug 2015 10:00

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Re: Biocellatussssssssssjjj

Berichtdoor Ruben » 22 aug 2015 11:14

20 cent, weet je potverdorie wel niet hoeveel geld dat is? Man je zou toch gek zijn als je maar een 10 tientje teveel voor je hobby betaald.

Teunis wat ga je doen, is je twijfel al weg?
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Re: Biocellatussssssssssjjj

Berichtdoor Teunis » 23 aug 2015 16:49

Ha Lode,

1.005 verwijst naar het soortelijk gewicht van het water. puur water van 25 graden celcius heeft een soortelijk gewicht van 0.998.
1.005 heeft daarmee een zoutgehalte van 0.7% gemeten naar gewicht. aangezien daar ook allerlei andere stoffen onder vallen zal het niet zover van 0,5% afzitten.

ons kogeltje was al onderdeel van een nu gezamenlijke inboedel, dus geen vreemde aankoop maar een besluit om het niet weg te doen.
het bakje waar ze nu in zit is het enige dat klein genoeg was om ingedraaid te verhuizen naar ons tijdelijk onderkomen. (ons huis is nog niet meer dan een gat in de grond) kwa zwemruimte is het denk ik wel te doen voor een kogeltje dat nu 4,5 cm is. stabiel houden moet ook wel lukken, ik heb wel minder stabiele waterwaardes goed gehouden. kwestie van goed onderhoud. Daarmee zeg ik nog niet dat het aan te raden is.....

ze zit nu overigens met enkel wat slakjes die zijn overgebleven van de lunch, de borarasjes zijn verhuisd naar een aquarium met meer soortgenootjes elders.

nogmaals ik promoot niet het houden van F8tjes op zoet. ik promoot alleen het zelf nadenken, actief opzoek zijn naar betrouwbare valide informatie, kritisch zijn en de discussie aangaan (op de inhoud uiteraard) volgens mij leer je daar namelijk van. Van klakkeloos dingen doen omdat iedereen het zo doet, zonder dat jezelf begrijpt waarom, leer je imo niks.

dat betekend ook dat je uiteindelijk begrip moet hebben voor mensen die een andere keuze maken, ik zou om meerdere redenen geen kogelvisjes redden. Maar als iemand wel overwogen de keuze maakt om dat wel te proberen, heb ik daar respect voor, en ook voor de manier waarop iemand dat dan doet. zolang dat maar gefundeerd is op goede argumenten. Een fundamenteel onderdeel van elk advies is dat iemand het ook niet op kan volgen. Anders was het een dictaat geweest. ;)

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waterwaardes vanmiddag:
pH 8.1
KH 8
GH- niet gemeten maar zal hoog zijn
NO2 niet aantoonbaar
NO3 5 ppm
PO4 niet gemeten
temperatuur 27,8 graden
zout: 1.003 (temperatuur gecorrigeerd)
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Re: Biocellatussssssssssjjj

Berichtdoor Lode » 23 aug 2015 22:57

Klopt het zit er niet ver vanaf maar is compleet andere schaal. Het is wel erg kort door de bocht om te zeggen dan 0,5% overeenkomt met 1.005.

Ah ok ik kende jullie situatie niet. Dat maakt het een heel ander verhaal. Ik vond het al niks voor jou :)

Ik ben het totaal eens met altijd verder kijken dan je neus lang is, zolang je dit slim doet en niet ten koste van de vis gaat.
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