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Kogelvis forum • Toon onderwerp - Biocellatussssssssssjjj

Biocellatussssssssssjjj

Alles omtrent brakwater kogelvissen

Re: biocellatussssssssssjjj

Berichtdoor Teunis » 20 aug 2015 22:11

Om afhankelijk van het seizoen in zoet, of brak te zitten is migratie helemaal niet nodig.
In de regentijd zal het water vooral zoet zijn, maar tijdens de droge tijden kan zout zeewater door het tij landinwaarts geduwd worden. Dichter bij zij kan het zoutgehalte zelfs bij elke wisseling tussen eb en vloed veranderen. En als dat niet ingewikkeld genoeg is, zout water is zwaarder dan zoet, (door het zout en doordat het vaak koeler is) waardoor water aan het oppervlak soms zoet is, maar op de bodem brak.

In brakwatergebieden wisselt het zoutgehalte dus constant. Zelfs aan een vis met een zendertje heb je dus niet zoveel. Bovendien is het visje niet erg interessant voor onderzoek. (financieel gezien)

De kleine eieren duiden wel op een visje dat in ieder geval als larve in water met een zeker zout gehalte leeft( of van zo'n soort afstamt). In brak/zout water in de buurt van riviermondingen komt namelijk relatief veel fytoplankton voor. De rivier voert voedingstoffen aan, er is weinig concurrentie van planten, het water is relatief warm en er is voldoende licht. Zoöplankton leeft dan weer van fytoplankton en kleine vissen larfjes van beide.

In puur zoet water leven jonge visjes vaak van insecten(larven) die in warm bijna stilstaand water, in overstromingsgebieden tijdens de regentijd, veel voorkomen. Deze prooien zijn groter en dus de larfjes ook en de eitjes waar ze uitkomen ook. bovendien is in dit soort gebieden voor de larfjes relatief weinig te vrezen van vijanden. De vissen kunnen het zich dus veroorloven om minder maar grotere jongen voor te brengen.

Ook in zee leven kogelvissen die veel lijken op de soorten uit zoet en brak. De band met de zee is ook in de biologie van kogelvissen dus nog wel terug te vinden. Maar ook dat zegt weinig over de zout behoefte van een individuele soort, er zijn immers veel soorten die geëvolueerd zijn naar volledig zoetwater.

De voordelen van zout zijn ook duidelijk, zoals gezegd: het beschermt direct en indirect (via een dikkere slijmlaag) tegen allerlei infecties. Alllerlei zuren hebben hetzelfde effect, bij veel kwetsbare soorten, veelal uit zacht zuur water, werd daarom vroeger zout toegevoegd. Dat is inmiddels achterhaald omdat het goed mogelijk is om zacht zuur water te maken. Bovendien is teveel zout voor dat soort visjes erg schadelijk, omdat ze juist gebouwd zijn om te overleven in water met weinig zouten.

Voor de f8 geldt dit laatste niet omdat ze ook in de natuur in water met zouten gevonden worden.

foto's volgen zodra ik beter inet heb, zit nu op mijn telefoon
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Re: biocellatussssssssssjjj

Berichtdoor Grunsven » 21 aug 2015 10:23

De Fishes of the Cambodian Mekong van de FAO schrijft over f8:
Found in slowly flowing and standing freshwater habitat from Borneo to Thailand.

Over T. fluviatilis wordt geschreven: found in Estuaries and freshwater tidal zones of rivers from India to Indonesia staying close to salt water.

Ik heb geen enkele concrete aanwijzing gevonden dat f8 trekt van zoet naar brak. Daarnaast is het duidelijk dat ze ver van zee in volkomen zoet water leven. Het lijkt er op dat fluviatilis in de zout beinvloede delen zit en f8 daar boven in het zoete deel van de rivieren leeft.
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Re: biocellatussssssssssjjj

Berichtdoor deijsmakerjeroen » 21 aug 2015 10:33

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Re: biocellatussssssssssjjj

Berichtdoor Ruben » 21 aug 2015 12:01

Misschien een domme vraag: vanaf welk punt kwalificeren ze water als brak? bij 1000.01? Heb dat een beetje lopen google maar kon dat niet echt vinden.
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Re: biocellatussssssssssjjj

Berichtdoor Grunsven » 21 aug 2015 12:36

Meer dan 0.5 gram zout per liter is brak, oftewel meer dan 1.005
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Re: biocellatussssssssssjjj

Berichtdoor Ruben » 21 aug 2015 13:32

Oke, dit volg ik even niet. Ik gebruik die tabel van Hugo index.php?i=content&mode=waterkwaliteit&category=Opstarten+brakwater+aquarium

1.005 dan heb mijn f8 het grootste gedeelte van de tijd op zoet gehad. Sorry als ik off topic ga.
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Re: biocellatussssssssssjjj

Berichtdoor Grunsven » 21 aug 2015 13:38

Ach er zijn allerlei definities, er is geen wet die zegt wat brak en wat zoet is. Onder de 0.5 gram per liter zullen de meeste planten het ook gewoon prima doen en merk je dus amper dat er zout in zit.

Wat het soortelijk gewicht is hangt ook af van de temperatuur en daarom een slechte maat voor dit soort dingen. Het kan best dat bij 25 graden 0.5 gram ongeveer 1.002 is
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Re: biocellatussssssssssjjj

Berichtdoor Ruben » 21 aug 2015 13:49

Waarschijnlijk zal het hem dan daarin zitten, lijkt me toch dat men aan de hand daarvan een vis bepaalt als zoet,brak of zee. Neemt niet weg dat ik wel steeds meer artikelen vind die f8 als zoet beschouwen dan 4 jaar terug.
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Re: biocellatussssssssssjjj

Berichtdoor Juliette » 21 aug 2015 20:00

Ik denk dat je daar ook een goed punt hebt. Welke definitie van brak gebruiken de wetenschappers?

@Jeroen; dat effect zie je ook bij de grotere gsp. Zwart op zoet en mooi wit en geel op brak/zee. Volgens mij heeft het zwarte niets van doen met de jeugdigheid maar alles met ongemak. Mijn neurotische F8 werd ook helemaal grauw onder stress (bakonderhoud).
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Re: biocellatussssssssssjjj

Berichtdoor Nanda » 21 aug 2015 21:46

Kan je een link neerzetten van dat stuk Roy?)
True pufferlove does exist!
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